Massillon => City Of Massillon => Topic started by: Shreve Legal Team on June 01, 2017, 12:45:17 PM

Title: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 01, 2017, 12:45:17 PM
(http://pbs.twimg.com/media/CQzercZUAAEcmOt.jpg)

THE VIEW OF THE SHREVE LEGAL TEAM

PARTS UNKNOWN IN THE SUBURBAN HEARTLAND OF OHIO:

Buried in the April 20, 2017, Massillon Board of Education minutes is the following: Becca Moore received a two-year contract renewal through 7-31-2019.

Does this mean Nate Mooranto's renewal is already in the bag? His contract is up after this season.

Bluntly, with the graduation losses from the 2016 underachieving team, 2017 doesn't look like a great season by any stretch. So it never made sense to me why Mooranto didn't go after jobs after the 2016 season ended. If youse left town after 2016, you could have saved face. Your record would have been 12-8 (9)*, 1-1 vs. McKinley.

You have the stink of the OHSAA Munford debacle on your record. So Mooranto's legacy if he left after 2016 would have been a Chuck Shuff-like win/loss record, an OHSAA legacy as bad or worse than John Maronto, and other off the field debacles (Soft Serve Cupps, exhibit A).

Despite all that, someone would have hired Nate Mooranto after 2016. Someone would take a Massillon coach with a 12-9 record even with the OHSAA stink.

Why didn't he bolt town?

Becca Moore's two year contract extension perhaps tells us why.

The powers that be in Massillon; Da Klub, BOE, admin, Orangemen, etc., all OWN the hiring of Nate Mooranto. They are invested in this because THEY hired Mooranto and THEY set the agenda of this coach.

I suspect Nate Mooranto didn't look for other coaching positions after 2016 because a contract extension is coming irregardless of all of the previous off-the-field embarrassment or how potentially bad or good the 2017 season will be. He's getting two more years even if the Tigers go 1-9, 5-5, or 10-0 (that ain't happening). It's what I suspect.

I mean, why did his wife get two more years? They could have done a one year deal for Becca, right? Why two years?

El Spizo Chicone has at great length pointed out the situation with Becca Moore. He's revealed Mania, Linda Cooper, and more. Go through the forums... it is all there.

There are things that I just do not believe an educator should do. Participating in a movie with the image of Mania is one of those things.

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/M/MV5BMTQ1OTkwNjQxOV5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTgwMDU3MjAwODE@._V1_UY1200_CR85,0,630,1200_AL_.jpg)

If you're a cabbie or truck driver, you do not get a DUI.
If you're a drug counselor, you don't deal weed.
If you're a cook, you wash your hands.

If you're an educator, you don't act or associate yourself with a movie like Mania.

This doesn't seem to be an issue to the Powers That Be in Massillon. They own the hiring of Nate Mooranto.

Spinning a contract renewal is easy. Spin away:

"Mooranto needs more time as coach."
"Nate has to rebuild from Jason Hall."
"Our talent is down."
"We don't have money to buy him out after Hall."
"We need to show the world that we don't quickly run out coaches."
"McKinley kept Thom for 16 years."
"We need stability."
"We're not a football factory (laughable)."

There's a 1,000 different ways to spin this.

The local rag, the Spindependent, didn't mention the two year extension of Becca Moore. They buried this item more than a pile of Larry Flynt magazines at the bottom of Mt. Rumpke Landfill.

I'm not in favor of this regime staying here. Go look through the archives of our forums and you'll see what El Spiza has revealed. The OHSAA debacle alone was enough for me. This is not about wins or losses like all of you think.

I think the OHSAA is a joke but anyone with a small amount of common sense should know Massillon is a target to the OHSAA. So why go through the ordeal to bring Munford here? He could have just gone to class and no one would have cared about that. This was all about football.

And after getting Munford eligible to play his 3 games, why didn't Nate Mooranto and his handlers of the Massillon Powers That Be fight the rest of the OHSAA charges?

It's all a joke. It's shameful.
And I think it is getting another two years since Becca Moore did.

Win with integrity. Stop acting like Kentucky basketball.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 02, 2017, 09:09:06 PM
Fellow Tuff guys,let me start off by saying, I am a long time reader,first time poster. Great forum by the way...As a fellow diehard, this is as concerned as I have ever been with the direction of the program. We just ain't going to win with the Marshmallow man Mooranto at the helm. He has already been a debacle, the first year was what we thought it would be, but the second year was really head scratching. From the recruiting scandal,the porous D to the embarrassing exit from the playoffs. This interloper has already shown his hand,he's not here to build us back into a winner, he's just here to put head football coach of Massillon on the resume. If Mooranto couldn't get us to at least the Regional Finals last year with the talent we had across the LOS, what will happen this year? Cut the cord!
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 02, 2017, 11:17:07 PM
Fellow Tuff guys,let me start off by saying, I am a long time reader,first time poster. Great forum by the way...As a fellow diehard, this is as concerned as I have ever been with the direction of the program. We just ain't going to win with the Marshmallow man Mooranto at the helm. He has already been a debacle, the first year was what we thought it would be, but the second year was really head scratching. From the recruiting scandal,the porous D to the embarrassing exit from the playoffs. This interloper has already shown his hand,he's not here to build us back into a winner, he's just here to put head football coach of Massillon on the resume. If Mooranto couldn't get us to at least the Regional Finals last year with the talent we had across the LOS, what will happen this year? Cut the cord!

This addresses Moore and the Shit show he brought to town...  however you could fire Moore tomorrow or 5 years from now and the same problem exists.

Basically Moore, Hall, and Stacy are the same.  The only difference is who pulls their strings and both Hall and Moore were "out of nowhere" hires after we got refused by better applicants that we offended out of wanting to work here, better candidates we embarrassed our selves chasing that didn't want to be here.

To the point that more than once rumors were floated out, the press printed them, and we all got sucked in just to have the "candidate" make a statement that he never even considered it and was flatly not interested in the job.




------


More or less, you can fire Moore, you shouldn't have renewed his wife....  but who is going to replace him?  As long as the Ringling brothers Barnum and Bailey worst interview crew on earth is doing the hiring...  I have no confidence anything gets better, and a strong feeling it gets worse.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 08:23:09 AM
Fellow Tuff guys,let me start off by saying, I am a long time reader,first time poster. Great forum by the way...As a fellow diehard, this is as concerned as I have ever been with the direction of the program. We just ain't going to win with the Marshmallow man Mooranto at the helm. He has already been a debacle, the first year was what we thought it would be, but the second year was really head scratching. From the recruiting scandal,the porous D to the embarrassing exit from the playoffs. This interloper has already shown his hand,he's not here to build us back into a winner, he's just here to put head football coach of Massillon on the resume. If Mooranto couldn't get us to at least the Regional Finals last year with the talent we had across the LOS, what will happen this year? Cut the cord!


I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, but what does "having Massillon on your resume" do for a coach nowadays? Maybe it says, "this guy has had to put up with unrealistic expectations".  If I'm hiring an assistant at a large college, or a head coach at a small college, having Massillon on your resume doesn't impress me.

You guys talk about "all this talent" we had last year....How do you think the '16 Tigers would have faired against the '91 Tigers? How about the '01 or '02 Tigers? Heck, even the '09 Tigers? Sorry but a bunch รต linemen who I witnessed get their asses kicked against a smaller group of kids with more heart isn't exactly what I call oodles of talent. Now I'm not necessarily impressed with Moore, not with his x's & o's, not with his off the field shit show, with with the baggage he brings, but there has to come a time when we all admit that just blindly blaming everything on the coach isn't working.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 03, 2017, 09:23:27 AM
In the infamous text chain of The Cunning One, lee, and Lo Spazzie, I repeatedly warned those ham 'n eggers about Central Ohio football being better than those goofs realized. After all, Dublin Scioto has won a flipping state title and fields winning teams most every year.

HOWEVER.....the Tigers first round fold was unacceptable. That buck falls on Nate Mooranto's desk.

Mooranto gets the Jim Rome "triple u" designation normally reserved for bad emails sent to The Jungle. Only Nate's triple U for the Dublin game was:

Unprepared
Uninspired
Unwatchable
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 03, 2017, 09:19:21 PM
Massillon isn't at the same level of prestige it was 30 or 40 years ago, no one can deny that. With that said it is still a recognizable name brand in the football world and I think having that on the resume garners a bit of recognition.

 Where does the '16 team stack up against Massillon teams from the past? Well they're pretty far down the list... That '91 team was a team of destiny robbed. None of that really matters because that wasn't whom was on the schedule for the '16 team. "All the talent" in regards to the '16 team is not in terms of all time great Massillon teams, rather it was in terms of the teams that were scheduled or potential opponents in DII playoffs. Our team certainly had more talent than Perry this year, so what was the difference? Aside from the rest of the B.S. it comes down to the fundamentals of the game, blocking and tackling the football.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 09:51:22 PM
""our team certainly had more talent than perry this year?""

Really?

Perry played for and almost won a State Championship....what....In your visual, optic nature makes you say we were better than perry?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: buddyh on June 03, 2017, 10:04:10 PM
In your visual, optic nature makes you say we were better than perry?
Swell helmets?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 03, 2017, 10:28:58 PM
""our team certainly had more talent than perry this year?""

Really?

Perry played for and almost won a State Championship....what....In your visual, optic nature makes you say we were better than perry?

Looking at the rosters from both teams last year, you honestly believe Perry had more talent than Massillon? Perry has one kid that really stood out to me and that is the Carrick kid on the oline. Just because they played for the DII championship doesn't equate to them having a more talented roster.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 10:35:13 PM
Ok....Perry won 4 games just to get to the title game....We couldn't even get past round 1. You can...."look at all the rosters you want." Perry has some tough, hard nosed kids who won't allow themselves to get their asses kicked by smaller, less talented kids. And I freaking hate Perry....Just being honest with ya.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 10:36:52 PM
Swell helmets?


Lol, Massillons helmets kick Perry's helmets ass.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 10:38:48 PM
Swell helmets?


Lol, Massillons helmets kick Perry's helmets ass.
Looking at the rosters from both teams last year, you honestly believe Perry had more talent than Massillon? Perry has one kid that really stood out to me and that is the Carrick kid on the oline. Just because they played for the DII championship doesn't equate to them having a more talented roster.


Btw, you can tell who has more talent by "looking at the rosters?" 

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 11:09:00 PM
Massillon isn't at the same level of prestige it was 30 or 40 years ago, no one can deny that. With that said it is still a recognizable name brand in the football world and I think having that on the resume garners a bit of recognition.

 Where does the '16 team stack up against Massillon teams from the past? Well they're pretty far down the list... That '91 team was a team of destiny robbed. None of that really matters because that wasn't whom was on the schedule for the '16 team. "All the talent" in regards to the '16 team is not in terms of all time great Massillon teams, rather it was in terms of the teams that were scheduled or potential opponents in DII playoffs. Our team certainly had more talent than Perry this year, so what was the difference? Aside from the rest of the B.S. it comes down to the fundamentals of the game, blocking and tackling the football.


Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Firewatch on June 03, 2017, 11:13:10 PM



This is a great post Chiefy!!! Freakin spot on.👀
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 03, 2017, 11:15:47 PM
Massillon isn't at the same level of prestige it was 30 or 40 years ago, no one can deny that. With that said it is still a recognizable name brand in the football world and I think having that on the resume garners a bit of recognition.

 Where does the '16 team stack up against Massillon teams from the past? Well they're pretty far down the list... That '91 team was a team of destiny robbed. None of that really matters because that wasn't whom was on the schedule for the '16 team. "All the talent" in regards to the '16 team is not in terms of all time great Massillon teams, rather it was in terms of the teams that were scheduled or potential opponents in DII playoffs. Our team certainly had more talent than Perry this year, so what was the difference? Aside from the rest of the B.S. it comes down to the fundamentals of the game, blocking and tackling the football.
Massillon isn't at the same level of prestige it was 30 or 40 years ago, no one can deny that. With that said it is still a recognizable name brand in the football world and I think having that on the resume garners a bit of recognition.

 Where does the '16 team stack up against Massillon teams from the past? Well they're pretty far down the list... That '91 team was a team of destiny robbed. None of that really matters because that wasn't whom was on the schedule for the '16 team. "All the talent" in regards to the '16 team is not in terms of all time great Massillon teams, rather it was in terms of the teams that were scheduled or potential opponents in DII playoffs. Our team certainly had more talent than Perry this year, so what was the difference? Aside from the rest of the B.S. it comes down to the fundamentals of the game, blocking and tackling the football.


Let's remember that I'm a "Massillon guy" through and through..

That said....What "Garner's recognition" by having Massillon on the ole resume?

You want to say we're better than Perry and then talk about fundamentals?  Perry IS fundamentals....
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Smitty on June 04, 2017, 02:42:00 AM
Massillon teams have not won 800+ games through the years because of "talent"; rather, it's been due to playing sound fundamental football and intense preparation.

Fundamentals and preparation are a reflection of coaching.

Combine that with the occasional superior talent that pops-up every few years and you'll get a championship run.

Generally, shitty coaching will negate any talent advantage, generally speaking, as we've seen. Our 2005 team was an exception; those young men had a remarkable combination of talent (Brian Gamble) and heart that is not seen often & nearly pulled it off.

****

Since the idiots in charge (ie, the Booster Club et al ) brought in the last 3 bad acts that aren't / weren't qualified to coach an 8th grade team for Chuck Shuff, we're now seeing the total demise of our beloved football program by a bunch of ass-fucks that THINK they're improving things.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 04, 2017, 06:09:14 AM
Chiefy, I do believe you can look at a roster and make certain assessments on talent levels. Based on size, how many kids are getting scholarship offers etc. We had a few more scholarship athletes than Perry. Now I never said we were better than Perry, I just said we had more talent on our roster than Perry and lack of talent can't be used as a reason for our early, embarrassing exit from the playoffs. So the buck stops with the coaching staff.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: sheriffjohnstone on June 04, 2017, 07:38:10 AM
Sigh....two more years of "Mania."

And that's what's really f**ked up.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: lee on June 04, 2017, 03:35:31 PM
Massillon had no less than SIX D1 college players in 2016

4 in the sr. class

Munford
Robinson
McConnell
Anthony

At least two under class men.

Thomas
Welch


Perry had ONE.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 04, 2017, 03:57:44 PM
Munford? Really? What did he play 2 games?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 04, 2017, 04:48:30 PM
Massillon had no less than SIX D1 college players in 2016

4 in the sr. class

Munford
Robinson
McConnell
Anthony

At least two under class men.

Thomas
Welch


Perry had ONE.


All the guys you mention had their asses handed to them by smaller Scioto players. Except Thomas.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 04, 2017, 04:52:44 PM
Munford? Really? What did he play 2 games?


Massillon had no less than SIX D1 college players in 2016

4 in the sr. class

Munford
Robinson
McConnell
Anthony

At least two under class men.

Thomas
Welch


Perry had ONE.


Egret wants an explanation for your addition of Munford.

I want one for your addition of Welch.

Welch couldn't even work his way onto the field.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: lee on June 04, 2017, 06:25:23 PM
I don't hand out the scholarships. People much smarter than I DO.

Munford played in the most important games of the year.

Welsch holds a D1 offer from Miami of Ohio. Not using him is on the coaching staff.  Like most of the armchairs on here.....they must be smarter than the college scouts.  8)
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: murphy13 on June 04, 2017, 06:35:10 PM
Massillon had no less than SIX D1 college players in 2016

4 in the sr. class

Munford
Robinson
McConnell
Anthony

At least two under class men.

Thomas
Welch


Perry had ONE.
Not getting to see any of the games last year(except McK) I want to ask you something as someone who did(I only listened to the games on the radio down here since we don't have video broadcasting of the game.). After the four D1 upperclassman that received scholarships what was the rest of the talent like down the depth chart?  My biggest gripe with Moore was his decision to start Watson over Partridge a kid who got the job done for us all year long. Outside of that I thought Nate did a pretty good job by what I had heard all year long.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: LA Dragon on June 04, 2017, 07:31:51 PM
Welch has dropped out of the program and moved back to his mother's home in the Columbus slums. He's gotten into the hippie lettuce lifestyle.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 04, 2017, 07:36:16 PM
I don't hand out the scholarships. People much smarter than I DO.

Munford played in the most important games of the year.

Welsch holds a D1 offer from Miami of Ohio. Not using him is on the coaching staff.  Like most of the armchairs on here.....they must be smarter than the college scouts.  8)


I watched Welch early in the year, before his starting job was taken away, and wondered what a college recruiter saw in him.

The kids either aren't as good as advertised....Didn't prepare properly....Or simply shit down their legs.

I will say one thing, we seem to have a lot of Massillon guys on the staff this year. For all of the people calling for more Massillon guys on the staff it's time for us to see....And for those of you who HAVE been calling for it, I truly hope you're right but I just don't see it making a difference. Our declining numbers is nobodys fault.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Firewatch on June 04, 2017, 07:47:34 PM


I watched Welch early in the year, before his starting job was taken away, and wondered what a college recruiter saw in him.

The kids either aren't as good as advertised....Didn't prepare properly....Or simply shit down their legs.

I will say one thing, we seem to have a lot of Massillon guys on the staff this year. For all of the people calling for more Massillon guys on the staff it's time for us to see....And for those of you who HAVE been calling for it, I truly hope you're right but I just don't see it making a difference. Our declining numbers is nobodys fault.
Thats BS Chiefy it is somebody's fault, The God Damn school board and this stupid plan to have one freakin middle school.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 04, 2017, 08:02:37 PM
Massillon isn't at the same level of prestige it was 30 or 40 years ago, no one can deny that. With that said it is still a recognizable name brand in the football world and I think having that on the resume garners a bit of recognition.

 Where does the '16 team stack up against Massillon teams from the past? Well they're pretty far down the list... That '91 team was a team of destiny robbed. None of that really matters because that wasn't whom was on the schedule for the '16 team. "All the talent" in regards to the '16 team is not in terms of all time great Massillon teams, rather it was in terms of the teams that were scheduled or potential opponents in DII playoffs. Our team certainly had more talent than Perry this year, so what was the difference? Aside from the rest of the B.S. it comes down to the fundamentals of the game, blocking and tackling the football.

Here's the real deal, do we have as much talent as the 91 team last year?  Don't know, don't care.  99% of the problem in Massillon is comparing today to 20,30,40, 80 years ago.  None of that shit matters... what does matter is that we did, in fact, have 10x the talent on the field and got stomped nonetheless.

The 2016 team did not and will never play the 1991 team, so who cares?

The real comparison is that the 1991 team was realistically one score away from a title and the 2016 was one playoff win away from having one playoff win.

The 1991 team lost to the eventual state champion by a missed Xp

The 2016 team lost by 10 to the team that lost to New Albany 31-7 the following week.

It's not an illusion that the 2016 was loaded with talent.  8 of the seniors are playing college ball next year, most if not all will never pay a dime for their college education because they can play football.

That's not counting a couple juniors who will get offers.

----


I get it, most of the time these teams talent levels get way overhyped and deserve the eye rolls, but 2016 was not overhyped. 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 04, 2017, 08:04:53 PM
Ok....Perry won 4 games just to get to the title game....We couldn't even get past round 1. You can...."look at all the rosters you want." Perry has some tough, hard nosed kids who won't allow themselves to get their asses kicked by smaller, less talented kids. And I freaking hate Perry....Just being honest with ya.

He's talking talent, you're talking coaching.

Reality is, and I hate to say this, if our team was 1/3 as well coached and disciplined as Perry's program internally and externally, we'd have walked to the title.

Perry deserves to be commended for getting the most out of every kid and every bit of talent out of every aveerage player. 

Bottom line, as much as Perry overachieved, we underperformed.

We need to accept reality before we can fix the issues.  The reality is the name Massillon doesn't mean shit to current circumstance, and we are going to get grifters and snake-oil coaches/boosters until we admit it to ourselves.

Case in point, 30 years ago we could ignore Keith Wakefield's application, today he's completely out of our league.

Keith Wakefield runs the same offense the same way he did 30 years ago.  He hasn't got any better, so that leaves only one other conclusion.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 04, 2017, 08:11:14 PM
Massillon teams have not won 800+ games through the years because of "talent"; rather, it's been due to playing sound fundamental football and intense preparation.

Fundamentals and preparation are a reflection of coaching.

Combine that with the occasional superior talent that pops-up every few years and you'll get a championship run.

Generally, shitty coaching will negate any talent advantage, generally speaking, as we've seen. Our 2005 team was an exception; those young men had a remarkable combination of talent (Brian Gamble) and heart that is not seen often & nearly pulled it off.

****

Since the idiots in charge (ie, the Booster Club et al ) brought in the last 3 bad acts that aren't / weren't qualified to coach an 8th grade team for Chuck Shuff, we're now seeing the total demise of our beloved football program by a bunch of ass-fucks that THINK they're improving things.

The win tally was impressive 1900-1980 when we had to play tough teams to get the rankings/votes and real harbins to achieve anything.

How many scrubs have we played since then?  How many of our wins in the past 20 years are quality teams vs struggling programs stopping by for a beating and a check.



The reality is, we've scheduled our winning tradition the past couple decades, we haven't gone out and earned it.

(Before any of this rah-rah "play the team you're scheduled crap", we scheduled them, we aren't in a league so all games are chosen by us regular season)

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 04, 2017, 08:28:29 PM


I watched Welch early in the year, before his starting job was taken away, and wondered what a college recruiter saw in him.

The kids either aren't as good as advertised....Didn't prepare properly....Or simply shit down their legs.

I will say one thing, we seem to have a lot of Massillon guys on the staff this year. For all of the people calling for more Massillon guys on the staff it's time for us to see....And for those of you who HAVE been calling for it, I truly hope you're right but I just don't see it making a difference. Our declining numbers is nobodys fault.

Declining numbers mean exactly nothing because OHSAA has 7 of these things called divisions.  You see, we suck against teams our size the same as we do against teams bigger and often smaller than us.

So no, size doesn't matter much...  especially given we are not in a league and in no way required to schedule teams in more populous divisions.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 04, 2017, 08:50:45 PM
Great discussion, love the tuff talk. Spize amen brother you just summed up everything I stated earlier, we had plenty of talent to win at a high level last year, but the Marshmallow man Mooranto let us all down during the playoffs. So now that we all agree to that point where do we go this year under the direction of Mooranto? There are some bright spots with Thomas and Watson coming back, the Keirns kid should develop nicely along the LOS, Kutscher could be a reliable weapon at WR,a young lefty gunslinger at Qb and Simpson at LB. We'll definitely need some young men to step up and for the coaching staff to develop and harness that talent, but I thought that is what Mooranto was known for at previous stops?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Al. on June 04, 2017, 09:24:44 PM

I will say one thing, we seem to have a lot of Massillon guys on the staff this year. For all of the people calling for more Massillon guys on the staff it's time for us to see....And for those of you who HAVE been calling for it, I truly hope you're right but I just don't see it making a difference.

Bingo
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 04, 2017, 09:25:07 PM
I don't have faith in Nate Mooranto.

I once had a lot of faith in Marion "The Swamp Fox" Campbell back in '87 with the Hotlanta Falcons and all I got was a 34-80 record and this photograph:

(http://www.footballperspective.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Campbell.jpg)

Bottom line, the OHSAA debacle was enough for me. Mania, Soft Serve Cupps, and drug growers hanging around the program were added bonuses and ALSO enough for me.

I'd say....who is the replacement but after Becca's new deal, I'd say this group isn't going anywhere. And I don't trust the people doing the hiring.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 04, 2017, 09:56:14 PM
Declining numbers mean exactly nothing because OHSAA has 7 of these things called divisions.  You see, we suck against teams our size the same as we do against teams bigger and often smaller than us.

So no, size doesn't matter much...  especially given we are not in a league and in no way required to schedule teams in more populous divisions.


Declining numbers mean that families are leaving for one reason or another, chasing jobs, unhappy with educational opportunities, etc....Either way, we're losing quality kids. Now, you can talk about divisions all ya want losing kids is losing kids.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 04, 2017, 10:32:05 PM


Declining numbers mean that families are leaving for one reason or another, chasing jobs, unhappy with educational opportunities, etc....Either way, we're losing quality kids. Now, you can talk about divisions all ya want losing kids is losing kids.

I'll type slowly so as youse can understand me better....

That's the point.  That's the entire theory behind divisions.  Understand, the general idea is less kids, less families, less opportunities for talent to pop up by the law of averages. 

The decline in enrollment doesn't matter because we are playing teams in the playoffs that have the same enrollment or less.

How do you solve that?  Divisions.  Considering every school regardless of size plays 11 on offense and 11 on defense, the reality becomes when you have 1200 boys at your school you're more likely to have 11 stronger athletes than if you have a population of 300.

Generally it works out that way.

Now, you have privates that use selective enrollment and shift the paradigm, and you have schools like us and like Steubenville that blatantly recruit kids but manage to do it in a way to make it look legit, legit enough to not get punished by OHSAA (sometimes, other times we threaten them with the cost of court battles and they settle).

Take, for example, the new competitive balance rules.  They are designed to prevent schools from attracting a lot of transfers being too powerful in their smaller divisions.

That should be a glaring red flag for us.  We literally get credited more boys because we should have an advantage, but even when we cheat we suck at that too and end up still losing to teams with less boys and no transfers.

---


The real problem is those with power and influence are pushing agendas, most of the pushing in prodding has nothing to do with being better at football anymore, it's all about credit, glory, relevance, and influence.

We could be 0-10 and these assholes would still be cloak and dagger fighting each other for control of the ship. 

Have you noticed whether it be Hall, Moore, Stacy... or one of the 10+ OCs we have had under these coaches, we end up looking like the same team with the same playbook greatly resembling an 8 year old playing madden?

You ever notice how many kids that are badass players we find mid season after an injury?

You think these kids all look that bad in practice?  That many kids, this many years?

To top it off, we have a kid get his college paid for that rode the bench.

Dude, it's bad.  Again, I didn't even brush the massive off the field issues like our kids promoting a drug dealer and the coach's wife's hobbies.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 05, 2017, 06:00:35 AM
When you lose kids because mom and dad are chasing a job that no longer exists here, or because they want a better educational opportunity for little Johnny, you're losing better quality people. You're losing two parent families whose children are more disciplined than a kid who was raised in the hood not knowing who his daddy is, and mom has a different "boyfriend" every other week. Let us not forget the kid who is raised by grandma because not only is daddy a distant memory, mom is out whoring around and likes to hit the crack pipe. Now, as a coach, what kind of kid do you think is going to be more coachable, little Johnny with the two parents or little Billy, raised by grandma being able to do whatever he wants, staying out as long as he likes on school nights, barely staying eligible, and most likely has a problem with an authoritative figure like a coach? We used to have those kinds of kids back in the day too but we also had a lot more "quality kids". The problem with playing schools like Dublin is that I'd say the majority are kids with two parents who instill discipline in their kids while we're losing those kids.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 05, 2017, 07:59:28 AM
A few things, then I will sit back... 1) Perry was not even close in regards to talent. They have the right man at the top who runs HIS program, HIS way. He demands discipline, hard work, and character. 2) I am 100% for Massillon guys on the staff. But those guys are under the control of the head coach and how he runs his program. 3) There are plenty of schools with demographics like ours who win.

Some of you will never get it. It starts at the top! It starts with discipline, structure, hard work, etc. It must be demanded! My son asked me last year, why is Steubenville and Perry in the state championship game alot. I told him look at their leader and look what he demands. Look how those teams play football! They don't have the nicest uniforms or helmets, but damn do they play hard noses ball. He comes home from workouts now and will tell me all the time, I see what you mean now! There's a real problem inside the walls of our program, believe that!
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 08:01:09 AM
When you lose kids because mom and dad are chasing a job that no longer exists here, or because they want a better educational opportunity for little Johnny, you're losing better quality people. You're losing two parent families whose children are more disciplined than a kid who was raised in the hood not knowing who his daddy is, and mom has a different "boyfriend" every other week. Let us not forget the kid who is raised by grandma because not only is daddy a distant memory, mom is out whoring around and likes to hit the crack pipe. Now, as a coach, what kind of kid do you think is going to be more coachable, little Johnny with the two parents or little Billy, raised by grandma being able to do whatever he wants, staying out as long as he likes on school nights, barely staying eligible, and most likely has a problem with an authoritative figure like a coach? We used to have those kinds of kids back in the day too but we also had a lot more "quality kids". The problem with playing schools like Dublin is that I'd say the majority are kids with two parents who instill discipline in their kids while we're losing those kids.

Aside from your assumptions having little in common with reality and no correlation to any real statistical data...  understand you're not describing Massillon.

Massillon may or may not have a high rate of single parent households than Dublin, but frankly that's never actually played out as a disadvantage.  in fact, some of our better players in the past few decades have come out of such.

Regardless, your numbers don't play out.  I'm not sure what you think of Massillon, but in terms of what you describe there is some data available and a community nearby shares very similar numbers to us...  Perry.

Perry is very similar and seems to not share these issues. 

I'm gonna stop here, because I don't really care to hear much more of your not based in reality view on Massillon demographics nor do I wish to risk justifying you spewing any more of it.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 08:03:19 AM
A few things, then I will sit back... 1) Perry was not even close in regards to talent. They have the right man at the top who runs HIS program, HIS way. He demands discipline, hard work, and character. 2) I am 100% for Massillon guys on the staff. But those guys are under the control of the head coach and how he runs his program. 3) There are plenty of schools with demographics like ours who win.

Some of you will never get it. It starts at the top! It starts with discipline, structure, hard work, etc. It must be demanded! My son asked me last year, why is Steubenville and Perry in the state championship game alot. I told him look at their leader and look what he demands. Look how those teams play football! They don't have the nicest uniforms or helmets, but damn do they play hard noses ball. He comes home from workouts now and will tell me all the time, I see what you mean now! There's a real problem inside the walls of our program, believe that!

Let me add, as an aside, when I talk about a coach from Massillon that gets it I'm talking top down.

You can have as many "Massillon guys" on the staff as you want, but when the head guy is a Cincinnati grifter renting in Jackson, it means nothing.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 05, 2017, 09:13:16 AM
Aside from your assumptions having little in common with reality and no correlation to any real statistical data...  understand you're not describing Massillon.

Massillon may or may not have a high rate of single parent households than Dublin, but frankly that's never actually played out as a disadvantage.  in fact, some of our better players in the past few decades have come out of such.

Regardless, your numbers don't play out.  I'm not sure what you think of Massillon, but in terms of what you describe there is some data available and a community nearby shares very similar numbers to us...  Perry.

Perry is very similar and seems to not share these issues. 

I'm gonna stop here, because I don't really care to hear much more of your not based in reality view on Massillon demographics nor do I wish to risk justifying you spewing any more of it.


Don't talk down to me, I'm just giving my opinion like the rest of you. I don't disrespect you, I'd appreciate it if you didn't disrespect me. Obviously if any of us had an answer it would have been fixed by now. But....You're going to tell me that Perry has as many kids living with grandma as Massillon does?

And your going to say we "may or may not have a higher rate of single parent households than Dublin?" Ever been to Dublin? You don't really need studies to figure all that out really.

Yes, some of our better players HAVE come from less than ideal conditions, that is exactly my point, for every kid from such conditions, we've had 2 or 3 that have been from the other who have been more coachable. Those coachable kids are the ones who are gonna be leaving.

You're not sure what I think of Massillon? Have you not been paying attention for the last however many years? I love Massillon and always stick up for Massillon in EVERY case. EVERY case.

There has to be more to this thing than "our coach sucks." We've been running coaches off for year, how has that worked out for us? Coaches who have had success before coming here and have had success after leaving here. I understand the problems with the booster club and I believe those are real, but there has to come a point where we realize it's not always the coach.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 09:51:11 AM


Don't talk down to me, I'm just giving my opinion like the rest of you. I don't disrespect you, I'd appreciate it if you didn't disrespect me. Obviously if any of us had an answer it would have been fixed by now. But....You're going to tell me that Perry has as many kids living with grandma as Massillon does?

And your going to say we "may or may not have a higher rate of single parent households than Dublin?" Ever been to Dublin? You don't really need studies to figure all that out really.

Yes, some of our better players HAVE come from less than ideal conditions, that is exactly my point, for every kid from such conditions, we've had 2 or 3 that have been from the other who have been more coachable. Those coachable kids are the ones who are gonna be leaving.

You're not sure what I think of Massillon? Have you not been paying attention for the last however many years? I love Massillon and always stick up for Massillon in EVERY case. EVERY case.

There has to be more to this thing than "our coach sucks." We've been running coaches off for year, how has that worked out for us? Coaches who have had success before coming here and have had success after leaving here. I understand the problems with the booster club and I believe those are real, but there has to come a point where we realize it's not always the coach.

You can call it however you want, I wasn't speaking down to you.  City-data.com is a great resource, check it out.

You can argue both ways, but reality is there are successful athletic programs from rich neighborhoods and poor ones, two parent households and single parent households. 

The common theme in Massillon has been cloak and dagger backroom deals, successful coaches coming here to fail, and the same coots publicly chasing coaches out of town that snuck them in under cover of darkness.

1000s of new players, a dozen coaches, hundreds of assistants, and how many different administrators, superintendents, and even board members....

When do you realize you're not aiming at the right target. 

Everyone fails to notice it always degenerates into the same problems, same calls for the same reason.  Every new coach seems to bring in a bigger circus.  Maybe we become more numb, or more likely we live in higher planes of denial about how good of a job Massillon is.

Dude, we had to give Mania Momma Becca Moore a 6 figure gig to get Nate Moore to come here and take a 4x pay raise, and we pulled that one out of our asses after the most embarrassing clusterfuck of a coaching search yet.

Here's a trivia question for you...  who is the last Massillon head coach that actually applied for the job during the application period?

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 05, 2017, 03:36:07 PM
Is the answer Bud Houghton?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 05:03:57 PM
I'm not old enough to actually know the answer
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 05, 2017, 07:33:30 PM
Not to change the discussion, but I was looking at the 17-18 football roster for us on hudl and I noticed a glaring omission. Keyshawn Watson was not listed, he was a JR last year? Insight from anyone a bit closer to the program?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 05, 2017, 10:07:38 PM
He's a lost cause. Some kids succumb to peers who don't want them to be successful
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 11:23:27 PM
Not to change the discussion, but I was looking at the 17-18 football roster for us on hudl and I noticed a glaring omission. Keyshawn Watson was not listed, he was a JR last year? Insight from anyone a bit closer to the program?

Probably the same reason he shouldn't be near a tiger jersey last season.

Didn't need him, other kids didn't want him...  team chemistry is a big thing in HS...  just ask Jason Hall
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 05, 2017, 11:27:38 PM
He's a lost cause. Some kids succumb to peers who don't want them to be successful

Especially when you have 2-3 kids who have gone out and proven themselves better and he gets treated like royalty just for strapping on the uniform. 

I sound like a broken record I'm sure, but these boosters and this town treating kids like they walk on water and can already write their check for playing on Sunday... 

I.e. A bunch of kids who stole from the very school itself a few years back, got caught, and not only stayed on the team but played?

Worst part isn't what you're teaching the troublemaker, it's what you're teaching that gritty hard nosed kid that isn't causing problems.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 06, 2017, 09:41:22 AM
Couldn't agree more Spize. And trust Nd believe me the same shit is going on now! So if your not disciplining the upper Glassman who aren't doing what they are supposed to be doing, what message is that sending to the younger kids in the program?
I think alot of people in here need to wake up! I'd rather have 30 kids who want to play and do it the right way, then 80 who have no respect for coaches, skip workouts, and arent bought into TEAM.
I will say it again, what I heard out of an upper Booster Club members mouth during the freshman banquet. We need to make sure we keep giving our kids things to keep them interested in playing football..... It still makes me want to puke!
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 06, 2017, 09:49:32 AM
Thanks for shedding some light on that. Was kinda hoping the kid would have learned something from last years isssues. Hate to see any kid, throw away a potential future for no reason. There has to be rules and consequences for actions and that should be a universal policy for everyone involved. You're right we need kids who value being a Massillon Tiger and want to put on that jersey with pride, because it means something that they are willing to sacrifice for.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 06, 2017, 10:11:48 AM
How does disciplining a player for grades show lack of discipline??? 

I don't have any inside info and hope it is not for his sake, but if you are ineligible you are ineligible.  Btw the football team earned a 3.0 team GPA last grading period.  Nice accomplishment in the scheme of things.  It is school after all.
   
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 06, 2017, 12:41:31 PM
At Niles when they talk discipline they get out the meat helmets, straps, and chains. Sometimes guns.

In the winter, the team swims laps in the Mahoning River.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 06, 2017, 12:42:52 PM
Quote
Couldn't agree more Spize. And trust Nd believe me the same shit is going on now! So if your not disciplining the upper Glassman who aren't doing what they are supposed to be doing, what message is that sending to the younger kids in the program?
I think alot of people in here need to wake up! I'd rather have 30 kids who want to play and do it the right way, then 80 who have no respect for coaches, skip workouts, and arent bought into TEAM.
I will say it again, what I heard out of an upper Booster Club members mouth during the freshman banquet. We need to make sure we keep giving our kids things to keep them interested in playing football..... It still makes me want to puke!

Is there anyone or anything tuffer?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 06, 2017, 01:05:23 PM
You guys are making my earlier point....These are the types of kids we're being left with. Prima Donna's who think they're bigger than the team or have to be motivated with swag....Living off the accomplishments of yesteryears Tigers. It's only gonna get worse.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: LA Dragon on June 06, 2017, 02:15:26 PM
Down in the low country, they go out and trap a raccoon, kill it, skin it and make Brunswick stew with tomatoes, okra and corn. Then for fun they put bourbon in their sweet tea and feed dry grits to the ants.

BJ Payne started that last tradition at Hilton Head High.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 06, 2017, 03:53:38 PM
"The kids we're being left with".....please tell me your joking. What and the hell does that (demographics) have to do with being a Prima-Donna???? Chiefy, why are they acting in such a way? Answer me that? Here's a hint, it isn't because they come from a one parent home
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 06, 2017, 08:26:56 PM
Let me GUESS. ITS THE COACHES FAULT?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 06, 2017, 08:49:03 PM
Just asked for an answer... Whos fault is it if you allow them to get away with it? The water boys?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 06, 2017, 09:14:06 PM
Seriously Chiefy. Who's fault would it be if not the coaches that coddle them?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 06, 2017, 09:14:26 PM
If a coach allows them to get away with it, yes, the coach is at fault.... 

BUT.

#1) the initial infraction was not initiated by the coach....It may have been swept under the rug by the coach....But it's not like the coach said, "go out and misbehave, I'll overlook it." So....You don't really know for sure if it's a result of a single parent home or not now do you?

#2) If we were winning and making deep playoff runs, the behavior of kids and how the coach handles it would be an afterthought.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 06, 2017, 09:17:06 PM
Seriously Chiefy. Who's fault would it be if not the coaches that coddle them?


Again, that type of behavior isn't learned overnight. They were "coddled" WAY before they ever met their HS football coach.

If the kid is a good athlete, he was most likely coddled by his pee wee coaches, by his parents and or grandparents.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 06, 2017, 09:59:08 PM
The problem is the feeder system. Of course the Boys & Girls Club sector of the football youth system is heavily involved with Vince Pedro.

He's also heavily involved with......DA KLUB.

DA KLUB is DA PROBLEM. El Spizelton is trying to tell youse that and youse stubbornly refuse to listen.

Just like you always vote for that Johnnie Full Slate.

You are morons.

Cicchinelli or even Brunckhart (sp) should be mayor. You dumbasses vote for Kathy Cavernous Potholes.

Good job.

Go run the Cleveland Clowns draft youse dopes.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 06, 2017, 10:50:51 PM
Chiefy, come on man... Be real here. What goes on in the program is in the head man's hands. He can either allow it or not allow it. Quit trying to validate your point. Its real simple
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 07, 2017, 06:05:26 AM
Chiefy, come on man... Be real here. What goes on in the program is in the head man's hands. He can either allow it or not allow it. Quit trying to validate your point. Its real simple

I guess this is where Chiefy and I differ. I get the fact they've been coddled forever. Once they mature (supposedly) enough to the high school level they are supposed to grow up. If they don't, then it's the damn coaches jobs to make sure they do. Not continue to entice them with all the bling humanly possible.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: LA Dragon on June 07, 2017, 06:28:01 AM


Again, that type of behavior isn't learned overnight. They were "coddled" WAY before they ever met their HS football coach.

If the kid is a good athlete, he was most likely coddled by his pee wee coaches, by his parents and or grandparents.

Chiefy, please define the word "coddled" in your context. I don't see too many middle school kids running around with new shirts, shoes and bling.

I do have some thoughts about the youth football program, though, it is the root of all the evil. SLT is starting to get it with his previous post, but not many others want to believe it.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: LA Dragon on June 07, 2017, 06:45:29 AM
Guys, chew on this for a while and think about the Tiger program.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://footballscoop.com/news/three-midwest-programs-going-state-title-game-cite-lack-youth-football-reason/&ved=0ahUKEwia6amGxqvUAhWLWz4KHfhYDlMQFgh4MBI&usg=AFQjCNE89WM5_d5HUsuFow_Q-NdwlZ5Sog
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 07, 2017, 07:32:59 AM
Chiefy, please define the word "coddled" in your context. I don't see too many middle school kids running around with new shirts, shoes and bling.

I do have some thoughts about the youth football program, though, it is the root of all the evil. SLT is starting to get it with his previous post, but not many others want to believe it.


In this particular context, my use of the word "coddle" (not originally MY word) means, basically, allowed to get away with things that other, not as talented kids are allowed to get away with. As I stated earlier, both the coach and the player are at fault. But if he has been allowed to skate by because of his athletic ability for basically his whole life, he's not gonna suddenly get to HS and straighten up.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 07, 2017, 07:33:55 AM
Chiefy, please define the word "coddled" in your context. I don't see too many middle school kids running around with new shirts, shoes and bling.

I do have some thoughts about the youth football program, though, it is the root of all the evil. SLT is starting to get it with his previous post, but not many others want to believe it.


It goes deeper than wanting the blind, but that is a part of it.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 07:49:11 AM
I don't think you'll ever get it. If I am the head man in charge of a program, business, office, etc.... I don't give a damn about you being coddled, how good you think you are, or your ego. That shit all stops when your in my program. I'd be dammed if I'm going to allow the shit that goes on, to continue to go on inside my program. If the athlete doesn't want to follow my rules, then bye bye! It goes back to why Perry has been playing for state championships and we have been struggling. Keith Wakefield isn't dealing with all that egotistical, non disciplined bullshit that goes on here. And believe me it's worse than you guys can imagine. Put a damn end to it, it's that simple. Steve Studer didn't allow it, I guarantee you that. Reno and Keith dont allow it. You can't be successful in the way we want to be, if you allow that shit to go on.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 07, 2017, 08:20:42 AM
Truth is always Tuff and BRM is speaking the truth! Not to change the subject but looking forward to the season, how would you use Jamir Thomas this season? Put him in the backfield again, move him back to the defensive side of the ball or play him both ways? What are your thoughts? I kinda liked watching him with the ball in his hands, punishing defenders.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 07, 2017, 08:27:10 AM
I don't think you'll ever get it. If I am the head man in charge of a program, business, office, etc.... I don't give a damn about you being coddled, how good you think you are, or your ego. That shit all stops when your in my program. I'd be dammed if I'm going to allow the shit that goes on, to continue to go on inside my program. If the athlete doesn't want to follow my rules, then bye bye! It goes back to why Perry has been playing for state championships and we have been struggling. Keith Wakefield isn't dealing with all that egotistical, non disciplined bullshit that goes on here. And believe me it's worse than you guys can imagine. Put a damn end to it, it's that simple. Steve Studer didn't allow it, I guarantee you that. Reno and Keith dont allow it. You can't be successful in the way we want to be, if you allow that shit to go on.


Wakefield also doesn't deal with an egotistical, wannabe, generic Booster Club either. Let's not forget those tools.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 07, 2017, 08:45:10 AM
I find it very odd/ironic so many feel Massillon/Canton kids are coddled (spoiled) while wealthier communities have it rough?  You should get out more.  My kids are at that age and I see first hand the amount of private training and infrastructure the more successful programs have.  Hoover girls travel all over the country.  Jackson hitters and pitchers pay $100+/hr (as early as 5th-6th grade) from former major league coaches/players at state of the art private facilities.  Their "gear" is top notch.  Anyhoo... 

Chiefy was right about the well educated and younger more affluent stable families moving to newer communities with better neighborhoods and jobs.  That is just reality.  I know "what we are left with" rubbed people the wrong way but Oil Filter called this demographic shift years ago.  It hit Canton first.  We are hanging on by a thread.  Whatever happened to him?  Hopefully nothing.

I would LOVE to think "1" person could reverse all that and turn us into circa 1970 Massillon kids but that's blissfully wishful thinking (fantasy).

 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 07, 2017, 08:50:50 AM
I'd just like a program where the Booster Club didn't embarrass us weekly, the coach's wife didn't think she was Leigh Anne Tuohy and act in questionable films, we didn't get fined $5K for questionable practices (Booster Club paid and then went begging for money), we didn't spend $2K to cart a live tiger up for one game, and didn't have a coach that was a puppet to them all. Is that too much to ask?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 07, 2017, 09:05:19 AM
That is not to say we (or McKinley) can't have very strong talented teams but just fewer and further between.  If we are improved over last year (as we were from the year before) we should be pretty decent, but some big ??? still, mostly at QB and defensively.  We'll see.
 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 10:23:59 AM
You guys are making my earlier point....These are the types of kids we're being left with. Prima Donna's who think they're bigger than the team or have to be motivated with swag....Living off the accomplishments of yesteryears Tigers. It's only gonna get worse.

You seem to be missing that I'm talking about the kids we are bringing in via booster club recruiting.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 02:42:29 PM
If you guys only knew..... Boy, o boy
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 07, 2017, 03:06:56 PM
We'll fill us in.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 03:14:49 PM
I've tried, in just about as many ways as I can. Sometimes it takes reading between the lines.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 07, 2017, 04:54:14 PM
Come on and give us a few examples. Drive your point home.

I'm doing some reading between the lines and i could be wrong, set me straight. You don't need to use names of kids OR coaches, but don't be one of those guys. If it's bad enough that you can make the statement, "if you guys only knew", then it must be pretty bad. Let's hear it.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 05:11:53 PM
Chiefy you, not anyone else needs to try and corner me in. I've stated in easy enough terms the problems that are still going on within the program. You may choose to overlook them or blame it on coddeling, but there's serious issues.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 07, 2017, 08:39:47 PM
If that were the case then I'd say Jarvis, Simon, Leno, McConnell, Roddy, and Hack aren't doing their jobs. And I guess the other 3 non-Tigers can plead ignorance. They don't get it. You get it though.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 07, 2017, 08:54:13 PM
Dude, I'm not the one who originally used the word coddling, I don't know how it got associated with every post that is in response to me.

I've given my opinions on what are big problems within the program too.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 10:51:57 PM
Chiefy, come on man... Be real here. What goes on in the program is in the head man's hands. He can either allow it or not allow it. Quit trying to validate your point. Its real simple

Which seems to be a job requirement.

3 in a row coaches hired outside of a legitimate application process.

You think maybe their is a litmus test to see how much they can be controlled and told what to do?

How many coaches met with our people and told us to fuck off?  A couple each time.  Check them out, all are coaches who run programs their way and don't take shit.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 10:55:09 PM
Chiefy, come on man... Be real here. What goes on in the program is in the head man's hands. He can either allow it or not allow it. Quit trying to validate your point. Its real simple

Which seems to be a job requirement.

3 in a row coaches hired outside of a legitimate application process.

You think maybe their is a litmus test to see how much they can be controlled and told what to do?

How many coaches met with our people and told us to fuck off?  A couple each time.  Check them out, all are coaches who run programs their way and don't take shit.

Truth is always Tuff and BRM is speaking the truth! Not to change the subject but looking forward to the season, how would you use Jamir Thomas this season? Put him in the backfield again, move him back to the defensive side of the ball or play him both ways? What are your thoughts? I kinda liked watching him with the ball in his hands, punishing defenders.

I'd take a look at keeping him on defense and using someone else to run the ball.

We have a few kids who can run but kids who are defensively smart like Jamir are in short supply.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 10:56:41 PM
Wakefield also doesn't deal with an egotistical, wannabe, generic Booster Club either. Let's not forget those tools.
Wakefield also doesn't deal with an egotistical, wannabe, generic Booster Club either. Let's not forget those tools.

Perry does have boosters and they all have opinions...  the difference is they shut up and push the same direction as the coach once the pads start to pop.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 10:59:25 PM
Come on and give us a few examples. Drive your point home.

I'm doing some reading between the lines and i could be wrong, set me straight. You don't need to use names of kids OR coaches, but don't be one of those guys. If it's bad enough that you can make the statement, "if you guys only knew", then it must be pretty bad. Let's hear it.

If that were the case then I'd say Jarvis, Simon, Leno, McConnell, Roddy, and Hack aren't doing their jobs. And I guess the other 3 non-Tigers can plead ignorance. They don't get it. You get it though.

You just named a bunch of guys who need their jobs and know sticking their neck out in this town will get it chopped off.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 11:11:46 PM
You just named a bunch of guys who need their jobs and know sticking their neck out in this town will get it chopped off.

Thanks Spize for stating the damn obvious. Red you'll get it one day
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 07, 2017, 11:35:37 PM
Btw...  as much as the booster club is to blame for a lot of things, everything they do is our fault because too many of us turn our heads, bite our lips, and justify their bullshit somehow because we enjoy the show.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 07, 2017, 11:57:57 PM
If I took the time, I could find my post about that Spize. I said nothing will change until we get a grass roots movement saying enough is enough. Trust and believe I will ask my questions about the issues I've raised in this thread about discipline and what's going on inside the program, when the parent meeting happens
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 08, 2017, 06:22:28 AM
You just named a bunch of guys who need their jobs and know sticking their neck out in this town will get it chopped off.



Sticking their necks out?  I'm just talking about imparting attitude and effort.  You know, basic coaching responsibities.  The assistant coaches I'd always known where the way they were no matter who was HC.  They more or less handled those aspects and the HC coordinated broader issues.  As I mentioned before academically they are not performing like the lazy spoiled brats with bad attitudes you make out.  We had some very good players but I think are in denial about talent deficiencies in a few other key areas especially defensively.

 

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 08, 2017, 06:43:08 AM
Sticking their necks out?  I'm just talking about imparting attitude and effort.  You know, basic coaching responsibities.  The assistant coaches I'd always known where the way they were no matter who was HC.  They more or less handled those aspects and the HC coordinated broader issues.  As I mentioned before academically they are not performing like the lazy spoiled brats with bad attitudes you make out.  We had some very good players but I think are in denial about talent deficiencies in a few other key areas especially defensively.

 



Blah blah blah

The two players you and the old men stood up to cheer for last year are both known as much for their academic issues as well as their football prowess.

Hell, one is matter of record under oath in open court.



Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 08, 2017, 08:58:22 AM
To strengthen my case on talent.

#1 look at our kids from the past, size wise. And look at our kids now. Especially our skill players. Very small today compared to yesterday.

#2 look at the number of sophomores and especially FRESHMEN who not only get playing time, but start.

There was a time when if you weren't a SR. or a very talented JR. you weren't seeing the field unless Massillon was up 40 in the 4th....And even then there were Srs and Jrs who had to get THEIR mop up time in before the sophs.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 08, 2017, 09:05:40 AM
Chiefy you, not anyone else needs to try and corner me in. I've stated in easy enough terms the problems that are still going on within the program. You may choose to overlook them or blame it on coddeling, but there's serious issues.


Not trying to corner you in. How many times has someone made a comment on here like, "I have news on a situation but I can't say what it is." If you know something that would strengthen your argument, out with it. Or what's the point I'm making the statement?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 08, 2017, 09:17:04 AM
To strengthen my case on talent.

#1 look at our kids from the past, size wise. And look at our kids now. Especially our skill players. Very small today compared to yesterday.

#2 look at the number of sophomores and especially FRESHMEN who not only get playing time, but start.

There was a time when if you weren't a SR. or a very talented JR. you weren't seeing the field unless Massillon was up 40 in the 4th....And even then there were Srs and Jrs who had to get THEIR mop up time in before the sophs.

Again, it means nothing as we are division 2 and everyone else in our division is in the same boat.

We haven't exactly been getting embarrassed by perennial powers in the playoffs, we've been getting bested by teams smaller than us with for less talent.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 08, 2017, 09:23:00 AM
It's not "losing kids" I've been referencing, it's losing QUALITY kids.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 08, 2017, 01:38:52 PM
At the end of the day, there is no excuse for not competing at a high level at Massillon. Da Klub needs to get back to its original purpose of supporting the football team, instead of running it. No more special search committees for "qualified candidate", if a man doesn't seek out the position, that in and of itself raises red flags. Not sure how they run practices during the season or during the summer leading up to the season, but if they are inside that is a mistake. Indoor facility is beautiful and can be utilized during the winter and other ways, but not during fall camp leading up to the season or during the season. You don't play inside and you shouldn't practice inside. We have all the things and more you need to build a winner, but it is going to take the right person to take the reins and put things in their proper perspective....


Spize, great take on Thomas, the kid is a heck of a talent. Myself, I would build the offense around him this year, he's the center piece. Especially with a young kid coming in at Qb, I think that takes a lot of pressure off the qb until he gets adjusted. Plus there is just something old school and tuff about a big,bruising Rb.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 08, 2017, 11:37:50 PM
It's not "losing kids" I've been referencing, it's losing QUALITY kids.

Hang around sports outside of football.  Massillon has a ton of QUALITY kids.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 09, 2017, 06:50:00 AM
#1 We're not talking about other sports.

#2 If so, why are we not going after the coaches from these other sports who aren't producing either?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 09, 2017, 10:05:17 AM
#1 We're not talking about other sports.

#2 If so, why are we not going after the coaches from these other sports who aren't producing either?

#1 We should be

#2 We've neglected our other sports and their facilities to the point most of them we are lucky to have the coaches we can actually get to apply.  Don't rock the boat if it's full of holes at the waterline
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 09, 2017, 10:09:32 AM
You want me to explain things, how about an explanation for me too:

Why is othe Board of Education donating school funds to the Football Booster Club.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 09, 2017, 10:29:35 AM
How did the tennis team do this year?  I believe I read, maybe on twitter, 19-1?  Is that true???  How about Track?  Softball?  Soccer?  Baseball and basketball we do get bits and pieces of and seemed like positive seasons.  I agree non-football sports could use more attention.  I for one am interested.  But, people want what they want.

 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 09, 2017, 11:10:03 AM
How did the tennis team do this year?  I believe I read, maybe on twitter, 19-1?  Is that true???  How about Track?  Softball?  Soccer?  Baseball and basketball we do get bits and pieces of and seemed like positive seasons.  I agree non-football sports could use more attention.  I for one am interested.  But, people want what they want.

 

The exception does not disprove the rule.

Sometimes the parents care more than the school and town don't care
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 09, 2017, 11:46:15 AM
You brought it up I was just curious about the extent.  I agree we are a football town, and other sports not so much.  Would love to see that support improve.  I don't live there but "we" should look inward first.  JMO. 

I also understand we happen to be next to admittedly one of the best all-around sports leagues in Ohio, and some higher end communities, which presents some very unflattering comparisons, fair or not.  Plus it's one school's best sports compared to each of 7 different school's best.  Is what it is though.  Other than football their overall support is better. 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 09, 2017, 12:21:47 PM
You brought it up I was just curious about the extent.  I agree we are a football town, and other sports not so much.  Would love to see that support improve.  I don't live there but "we" should look inward first.  JMO. 

I also understand we happen to be next to admittedly one of the best all-around sports leagues in Ohio, and some higher end communities, which presents some very unflattering comparisons, fair or not.  Plus it's one school's best sports compared to each of 7 different school's best.  Is what it is though.  Other than football their overall support is better. 

Having a kid in youth sports has been eye opening...  besides being the "Township of Champions" in high school, Jackson does pretty darn good in youth sports.  What's been really eye opening is that Massillon holds their own and even excels at youth sports.

Massillon gives the Township of Champions everything they can take and more, and not just in sports not called "football" outside of the US.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 09, 2017, 12:46:08 PM
You brought it up I was just curious about the extent.  I agree we are a football town, and other sports not so much.  Would love to see that support improve.  I don't live there but "we" should look inward first.  JMO. 

I also understand we happen to be next to admittedly one of the best all-around sports leagues in Ohio, and some higher end communities, which presents some very unflattering comparisons, fair or not.  Plus it's one school's best sports compared to each of 7 different school's best.  Is what it is though.  Other than football their overall support is better. 

Remember kids, all other sports suck so focus all your money to the Football Booster Club,  everything else is a waste of money.

Of course we root for every other sport when Walt talks about them in the announcement between the swing band and 3rd quarter, but we all know their best seasons will end in a early playoff out.

So give your cash to the football booster Klub, because we are the sport that can guarantee an early playoff out after a mediocre regular season every year...

... but we do it with flashing lights and fireworks, so city of champions
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 09, 2017, 04:43:02 PM
You want me to explain things, how about an explanation for me too:

Why is othe Board of Education donating school funds to the Football Booster Club.




Probably because our BOE  just as dirty and crooked as every other aspect of Massillon.

Notice I said Massillon, not WHS. 
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 09, 2017, 10:05:56 PM
Some of you should talk to kids in the program....maybe some who aren't the "stars" lol
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: sheriffjohnstone on June 10, 2017, 07:51:43 AM
Let's get back on topic....who has a "Mania" Blu-Ray?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 10, 2017, 11:42:07 AM
Some of you should talk to kids in the program....maybe some who aren't the "stars" lol


Please explain.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 10, 2017, 01:52:37 PM
Chiefy, what needs explained??? Holy cow
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 10, 2017, 03:44:01 PM
Your ramblings need explained, that's what.

What is talking to the non star kids gonna do?

You made a claim that, "if we only knew"....I asked you to elaborate, you choose not to. YOU apparently "know". I'm not gonna go find a 16 year old kid, drag him into my windowless van with the promise of candy, and question him about the goings on of Massillon football. If you're so opposed to the goings on. Make shit public so we all can see the.   ....    Whatever the hell it is you're talking about.

Get it now?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 10, 2017, 09:45:14 PM
We have stars?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 11, 2017, 09:28:46 AM
Yes, they star in Mania.

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: JimD on June 11, 2017, 01:47:30 PM
Yes, they star in Mania.


Instead of getting stickers on their helmets, their helmets get sticky! Move over John Holmes....here cum the tigers...
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 11, 2017, 07:11:32 PM
Quote
Instead of getting stickers on their helmets, their helmets get sticky! Move over John Holmes....here cum the tigers...


That is one of the better comments we've had on here in a while.

Meanwhile, Cheefy and Red will continue to ignore the 50,000 ton fugged up lesbian love story of an elephant in the room.

And brm12? He's drinking battery acid to enhance his tuffness.

I also heard he berated a waitress at Yoder's in Mount Hope for not enough gravy with his dinner. He's beyond tuff.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 11, 2017, 07:14:09 PM
Cheefy: youse got a take on Jessica Cameron and Mania?

Or are you still into Hillary and need a box of tissues behind a closed door for her?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 11, 2017, 07:27:10 PM
Hey Chiefy, obviously you are and have been struggling to get the damn point!!! This program is in complete and utter dysfunction. The inmates are running the asylum. No discipline. "Stars" getting preferential treatment. Care-free attitudes. Conflicts between groups of teammates. How much more clear do I need to be????????? I mean holy shit, my 5 yr old son could understand what I have been stating on this thread and others for years.
The problem is, you and many others do not want to hear it! You want to blame the kids and look for reasons why we are not winning. I have been TRYING to tell you the REAL reasons why we struggle. IT IS NOT TALENT!!!! I can personally guarantee you that the shit going on inside our program is not going on at Perry, Steubenville, Central, etc. THAT IS THE REASON WE ARE NOT WINNING! ITS LACK OF DISCIPLINE! It is lack of team building, kids getting star treatment from young ages, kids in it for the wrong reasons, and a Booster Club who many times, does nothing but hurt the program.... Remember what the elder clubsman said to the Freshman team and parents last year????..... We give the kids all this stuff to keep them interested....
Now, I am done explaining myself. Some of you on here will never get it. Some of you will just want to roll another overpaid coach in. I want a coach who wants to be here, will tell the club to butt out, and will run his program with discipline and hard work as the two main criteria....whether we end up with 20 kids or 80 because of it.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 11, 2017, 08:06:19 PM
If youse dispute brm12's post above, you are a Klub rumdum and nothing more. Just go down to listen to Johnnie's polka band Visinata on your way to Kevin Smith's Tigertown Bar and Grill while being bitter Hillary lost. As you walk, just avoid the potholes as they are a legacy of Mayor Kathy Cavernous Potholes.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 12, 2017, 09:57:03 PM
Hey Chiefy, obviously you are and have been struggling to get the damn point!!! This program is in complete and utter dysfunction. The inmates are running the asylum. No discipline. "Stars" getting preferential treatment. Care-free attitudes. Conflicts between groups of teammates. How much more clear do I need to be????????? I mean holy shit, my 5 yr old son could understand what I have been stating on this thread and others for years.
The problem is, you and many others do not want to hear it! You want to blame the kids and look for reasons why we are not winning. I have been TRYING to tell you the REAL reasons why we struggle. IT IS NOT TALENT!!!! I can personally guarantee you that the shit going on inside our program is not going on at Perry, Steubenville, Central, etc. THAT IS THE REASON WE ARE NOT WINNING! ITS LACK OF DISCIPLINE! It is lack of team building, kids getting star treatment from young ages, kids in it for the wrong reasons, and a Booster Club who many times, does nothing but hurt the program.... Remember what the elder clubsman said to the Freshman team and parents last year????..... We give the kids all this stuff to keep them interested....
Now, I am done explaining myself. Some of you on here will never get it. Some of you will just want to roll another overpaid coach in. I want a coach who wants to be here, will tell the club to butt out, and will run his program with discipline and hard work as the two main criteria....whether we end up with 20 kids or 80 because of it.

If this wasn't a virtual place I'd engrave this on a plaque and put it on the front door.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 12, 2017, 10:14:08 PM
Underneath the author attribution to brm12, it needs to say:

"Built Tuff"
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 13, 2017, 08:20:53 AM
This should be plastered on the front of our web-site forever. Sorry. I meant Chicone's web-site. I overstepped my bounds there for a minute.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 14, 2017, 11:45:54 AM
I have gotten to the point to where I don't care what people think of me in town, and people need to know and accept what's really going on inside the program. Take the damn blinders off people! The booster club is a cancer, there's a total lack of discipline, and someone has to demand it all ends.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 14, 2017, 10:37:31 PM
I have gotten to the point to where I don't care what people think of me in town, and people need to know and accept what's really going on inside the program. Take the damn blinders off people! The booster club is a cancer, there's a total lack of discipline, and someone has to demand it all ends.

Ditto
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 14, 2017, 10:37:59 PM
We need a beer summit and podcast, get SLT up here and invite BRM
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: buddyh on June 14, 2017, 10:40:52 PM
I have gotten to the point to where I don't care what people think of me in town...
Like Scott Graber?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 14, 2017, 11:22:50 PM
Why don't we meet at the downtown McDonald's and why aren't we playing St. Ed's or Elder or Moeller?

(http://grumpyoldguy.weebly.com/uploads/8/8/8/9/8889249/6642462.jpg?153)
Beat Niles
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Egret on June 15, 2017, 09:43:39 AM
We need a beer summit and podcast, get SLT up here and invite BRM

Make it August and I'm all in. I'll have my baby girl with me too.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 15, 2017, 12:53:15 PM
I have gotten to the point to where I don't care what people think of me in town, and people need to know and accept what's really going on inside the program. Take the damn blinders off people! The booster club is a cancer, there's a total lack of discipline, and someone has to demand it all ends.


Same here. I brought back a thread I started about 7 months ago called "is it time."
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 15, 2017, 04:40:48 PM
If your tired of it Chiefy, why do you always look for excuses and try to overlook the simplicity of the issues?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 15, 2017, 09:53:32 PM
Excuses? Give me a break. It's a fact that we don't have the talent that we used to, if you don't realize that, then you're the one overlooking the simplicity of the issue.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 15, 2017, 09:59:47 PM
Hey Chiefy, obviously you are and have been struggling to get the damn point!!! This program is in complete and utter dysfunction. The inmates are running the asylum. No discipline. "Stars" getting preferential treatment. Care-free attitudes. Conflicts between groups of teammates. How much more clear do I need to be????????? I mean holy shit, my 5 yr old son could understand what I have been stating on this thread and others for years.
The problem is, you and many others do not want to hear it! You want to blame the kids and look for reasons why we are not winning. I have been TRYING to tell you the REAL reasons why we struggle. IT IS NOT TALENT!!!! I can personally guarantee you that the shit going on inside our program is not going on at Perry, Steubenville, Central, etc. THAT IS THE REASON WE ARE NOT WINNING! ITS LACK OF DISCIPLINE! It is lack of team building, kids getting star treatment from young ages, kids in it for the wrong reasons, and a Booster Club who many times, does nothing but hurt the program.... Remember what the elder clubsman said to the Freshman team and parents last year????..... We give the kids all this stuff to keep them interested....
Now, I am done explaining myself. Some of you on here will never get it. Some of you will just want to roll another overpaid coach in. I want a coach who wants to be here, will tell the club to butt out, and will run his program with discipline and hard work as the two main criteria....whether we end up with 20 kids or 80 because of it.


It ain't going on at Steubenville? Lol....Tell me another one.

You mean the town where the coach took all the cell phones in an attempt to erase evidence of a rape to help out the star players?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 15, 2017, 10:01:48 PM
To strengthen my case on talent.

#1 look at our kids from the past, size wise. And look at our kids now. Especially our skill players. Very small today compared to yesterday.

#2 look at the number of sophomores and especially FRESHMEN who not only get playing time, but start.

There was a time when if you weren't a SR. or a very talented JR. you weren't seeing the field unless Massillon was up 40 in the 4th....And even then there were Srs and Jrs who had to get THEIR mop up time in before the sophs.


Again....Any thoughts?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 15, 2017, 11:21:54 PM
Chiefy, you need to get off this site and run for President of the booster club. You would fit right in! Steubenville had one bad incident. That same Steubenville program is consitently playing in state championship games, and I can assure you the shit going on within the team here doesn't go on there. Reno has total control of that team. Disscipline, work ethic, and physicality aren't problems down there.
I can remember many juniors playing key roles on teams. I can also name a handful of sophmores getting time. There's a thing your forgetting in that statement, and that is the declining enrollment. That plays a big part! Size of the skilled guys? Lost me there.... Crabtree, Olack, Smith, Jasinski, Keirns, Partridge, etc etc etc... Maybe that skill isn't being used correctly???
You can continue to look l for excuses, call it what you want to.... We have talent here, we were more talented than most teams in our division. That's a fact!!!! But talent only gets you so far. Again, there's many other things going on inside that program that get you beat in the 1st round or give you a leverage season.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 16, 2017, 07:28:38 AM
Quote
Chiefy, you need to get off this site and run for President of the booster club.

He got connections with Johnnie 'n Eddie?
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 16, 2017, 09:26:44 AM
brm12, didn't you play for Shepas?  How would you rate team discipline, as far as grades, penalties, conduct, on and off the field?  And what about those three 4-6 seasons?

And just so you know I thought he was a good coach and would have him back - if it would not cause a shitstorm - which it would.

   
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Red50Go on June 16, 2017, 09:55:46 AM
You can continue to look l for excuses, call it what you want to.... We have talent here, we were more talented than most teams in our division. That's a fact!!!!

Other playoff teams have talent too.  This is where Massillon star mentality and overrated comes from.  The Perry's of the world take an opposite approach.

Instead of bragging how talented we are tell them the truth and put them to work.  We are noticeably slower, smaller, less physical at too many key positions vs. solid teams, a blind man can see that.  Other than that we have more talent.  That don't work.





       
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 16, 2017, 11:07:43 AM
Red50, I did play under Shep. That man ran a right ship! That man demanded the respect of his players! That man knew how to build a team! He played anyone, at anytime, anywhere! He said FU to the federal league! And he sure as he'll was not a puppet to people like you and the other boosters! He sure as he'll didn't bow down to any of his players, and the players knew who was in charge! His players busted their asses every Friday night for him! Also, without checking the history books, that man lead this program to a few state semi games and was a play here or there away from state championship appearances. You could also debate that the 05 team was just as much his...he groomed that team!
So Red50, keep going out and hand picking coaches that don't even want to be here! Keep paying him, his wife, and all his coaching buddies to come along as well! I love wasting my tax dollars!
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: LA Dragon on June 16, 2017, 11:24:29 AM
"90% of the game is half mental." - Yogi Berra

It doesn't matter how big, how fast, or how strong you are most of the time (although it helps!). What matters most is how mentally aggressive and smart you are. Some call it heart & desire, some call it football IQ, and some call it Tiger football.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 16, 2017, 03:59:18 PM
 Brm, I don't agree with what YOU have to say, so I should run for BC President? Get off your high horse. You're so pissed off that you're insulting me, you're insulting RG50....If you're THAT pissed, give us some of the examples I've been asking for. And how in the hell would you know if Steubenville had "one bad incident" or 35 of them? Are you an insider there too? You think nothing else bad has ever happened at Steubenville that got covered up or swept under the rug? I know you're not that gullible. You mention their (Steuby's) state title appearances, does that make the incident/s more acceptable to you? And seriously, I mean SERIOUSLY, how in the hell can you assure me that the "shit going on here doesn't go on there?" Again, are you an insider there too? And no, I didn't forget our "declining enrollment", if you were paying attention, I've brought that up many times only to basically be told it wasn't an issue. You named six players, you haven't noticed a lot of our skill players, be it starters or backups being on the small side in recent years? Hell I think our DBs the past couple of year were the smallest I've ever seen them. You think any freshmen would have been forced into action in the 70s 80s 90s or early to mid 2000s? I mean FORCED, sure some could have probably played and some could have actually excelled, but we never knew because we didn't need them to play, they weren't the best player at their position in the program. They may have been great, hell they may have been the best freshman in the state at their position, but we had a sophomore or a Junior or a senior or all of the above that was better than them. In the few instances where freshmen started in recent years, could we have said that there was an upperclassman that played the same position who was better? No, we could have because there wasn't. Again, how do you know how much talent is in our division? Have you seen every team play? You continue to make outrageous statements that paint yourself into a corner. I DO agree that talent only gets you so far, you have to have a little bit of heart too and from what I saw during our ousting from the playoffs, we had more than a few kids who....In my opinion....Were lacking in that department. I saw those kids on the computer making college visits and posting pictures of their time at the college's they were visiting, did some of them mentally "move on?" I don't know.  Lose interest in the HS game and were thinking prematurely of their next 4 or 5 years? I don't know. What I do know is that that got beat by smaller less herelded kids who simply wanted it more. Don't get me wrong, I'm not standing here pounding my fist for the Nate Moore regime, when a team consistantly gets beat by teams they really shouldn't get beat by, EVERYONE deserves some blame, but did YOU have to be motivated when you played or did you already have it in you?
As I said, don't mistake me for a staunch Nate Moore supporter, that I am not, I've just seen this song and dance too many times.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 16, 2017, 04:16:50 PM
Excuses? Give me a break. It's a fact that we don't have the talent that we used to, if you don't realize that, then you're the one overlooking the simplicity of the issue.

And again, we had 8 kids sign last year, not mentioning any kids on the team that's a junior or younger.

That's to say, we have talent.  As much as before?  Probably not, but we aren't playing Iggy in the semis, we are losing to Dublin Sciolto and Perrysburg in the first round division 2
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 16, 2017, 04:20:39 PM
brm12, didn't you play for Shepas?  How would you rate team discipline, as far as grades, penalties, conduct, on and off the field?  And what about those three 4-6 seasons?

And just so you know I thought he was a good coach and would have him back - if it would not cause a shitstorm - which it would.

   

Let's be honest here...  those 4-6 Shepas teams would have had a running clock on last year's team.

Not for talent, for coaching.

Take a look at Shepas's 4-6 schedule vs Moore's
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Spize on June 16, 2017, 04:22:48 PM
Other playoff teams have talent too.  This is where Massillon star mentality and overrated comes from.  The Perry's of the world take an opposite approach.

Instead of bragging how talented we are tell them the truth and put them to work.  We are noticeably slower, smaller, less physical at too many key positions vs. solid teams, a blind man can see that.  Other than that we have more talent.  That don't work.





       

That's Da Klub mentality though:  you are a star, you have so much talent you don't need to work out, follow rules, study, or anything else.

We are soft because Da Klub sets the tone and the coaches for 12 years have been puppets. 

Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 16, 2017, 05:03:29 PM
Chiefy, I give up trying to convince you guys... Red and you have your Booster Club pins on your shirts and will look for every excuse you can. It doesn't take a damn insider to see that Steubenville plays football, on the field, the right way!!!! It doesn't take an insider to know what kinda ship Reno is running. And go talk about the 70s, 80s, and the past all you want to....just like the Club does... We were a much bigger school, and we weren't losing kids left and right to Jackson, Perry, Tuslaw, Central, Fairness...etc...we were getting those kids.
Ya I'm pissed, the problem is there are more people like you looking for ways to explain it instead of people like me who have had enough of the circus.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: chiefy jones on June 16, 2017, 05:18:11 PM
Never been a member of the booster club, never been to a meeting from year to year I couldn't even tell ya who the president is, so....There goes THAT theory.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 16, 2017, 05:46:18 PM
Chiefy, look, I have met you and think highly of you. We will either agree to disagre on this or you can trust what I'm telling you. I'd think, you knowing me, you would tend to want to trust what I'm telling you. Not to say they won't go 10-0 this year, but it would be despite the underlying issues I have been preaching about
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: buddyh on June 16, 2017, 05:50:03 PM
I couldn't even tell ya who the president is
Psst.  It's Trump, Chiefly.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: 91Tigers on June 16, 2017, 06:36:16 PM
 Facts are we had more talent than anyone in DII, besides LaSalle last year and we were embarrassed in our own stadium by a smaller less talented Dublin Scioto team. That doesn't sit well with me, especially when Mooranto was brought in to be a program builder. A guy that can get it done with less talent. So far this hasn't been the case.

 Where do we go from here? This is another failure resting at the feet of the booster club. It has already been admitted a failure by having to fire your most trusted assistant in Cupps and basically admitting guilt in the OHSAA investigation by sitting out during the playoffs, along with the fine. Again the red flags automatically go up when the search committee hires a man that doesn't even bother to apply in the first place.

You have to be a dictator as a head coach, everything must start and stop with you. There can be nothing that goes on within or around that program that you aren't firmly in control of. That's not to say you don't delegate to your assistant coaches and coordinators, but the buck stops with you. Booster Club ain't running the show they can have meetings and support the team,but that's where it ends and that roll has to be clearly defined. They aren't running practices and setting the depth chart. Ultimate control must rest with the head coach and he must be the embodiment of that, not just an interchangeable figure head for the club.
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: brm12 on June 16, 2017, 07:30:54 PM
Hell of a post 91
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: lee on June 17, 2017, 12:40:52 AM
I for one would like to see a "loser leave town cage match" between brm12 and chiefy. 

Put it on the undercard of Mayweather-Mcgregor.

Drop the live Toger in the cage and let the mayhem ensue.   :D
Title: Re: Becca Moore Two Year Contract Renewal - What Does It Mean?
Post by: Shreve Legal Team on June 17, 2017, 08:11:14 AM
Huh. Funny the last couple years at the post game party at El Spizo Chicone's, we would have the TV68 Mansfield Game of the Week on because, well, it was another game to watch.

Ashland HS was on frequently and more than once I thought the Arrows played with more heart and were better koached than what I watched from the Nate Mooranto regime.

They're in our region this year.
Scott Valentine is a better koach than Nate Mooranto.

When Mooranto was hired, I was excited about his Minster HS resume. LaSalle was irrelevant to me.

Now I'm thinking Nate Mooranto just had a lucky cycle of talent at Minster. That can happen at small schools.